Ciara Kelly and Richard Hogan: 'People are messy, they hurt each other and themselves'
You Hogan New They And Have Out Ciara Dr Now It's Richard A Up, Weekly Dr Podcast, Kelly F*ck
The podcast takes its name from the first line in the Philip Larkin poem 'This Be The Verse': “They fuck you up, your mom and dad. They may not mean to, but they do.”
But the podcast is more than just a parenting or relationship podcast, says psychotherapist Dr Richard Hogan. “It’s us looking at all the difficult stuff that people don't like to talk about. The stuff that doesn't really get looked at in other podcasts.
"We want to talk about things that impact people's lives, things they struggle to talk about with their friends and family, or they feel embarrassed about. People are messy, they’re flawed and vulnerable and problematic, and they hurt each other, and they hurt themselves. And those are difficult things to discuss and navigate,” explains Dr Ciara Kelly.
The pair come to this podcast with more than 40 years of experience of being on the frontlines of people’s problems. In his role as a family psychotherapist Richard encounters the messiness of people’s lives every day, and Ciara, who was a family doctor for 20 years, has seen people at their most vulnerable.
After hearing Richard being interviewed on radio a couple of years ago, Ciara said that “he stood out to me as somebody I wanted to listen to, somebody who had a valuable insight that goes beyond qualifications".
The duo started working together, Richard as an expert on Ciara’s Newstalk Breakfast show, and it was during this time they realised the chemistry they had. “It's great to meet someone that you can have a deep academic conversation with and at the same time have fun in it. That's unique,” says Richard.
Both confessed “talkers”, Richard and Ciara are determined to take the stigma out of the issues that people deal with, particularly the problems they feel ashamed of or are embarrassed to speak to anyone about. “The idea is to talk about those things that are hard to talk about. We want to give good advice, while also making it accessible, and maybe even have a little bit of fun at times,” says Ciara.
The podcast, which launched on November 6 with a 30-minute episode dropping every Wednesday, will tackle topics such as affairs, anxiety, people-pleasing, jealousy and envy, how to date again after coming out of a long-term relationship, and how to thrive. As we approach the Christmas season, the pair are even considering an episode that talks about managing families over Christmas.
“You know what? An episode like that might be useful on Christmas Day for people. It’s all about those things that affect people’s everyday lives,” says Ciara.
The podcast comes at a time when Irish people are embracing the podcast format; nearly three quarters of us (72%) regularly listen to podcasts, with the average listener clocking up 48 minutes every day listening to a podcast, the equivalent of 12 days a year. We listen to them while on a walk (42%), doing chores (39%) and in bed (37%). And we’re tuning in to four different podcast series regularly.
In this competitive market, where there are podcasts on every conceivable topic, how do Richard and Ciara think their podcast will stand out?
“We recorded an episode recently where we talked about people pleasing. This is something people struggle with massively. It can destroy people's lives. You wouldn't realise how much it can impact some people. And we also spoke about jealousy, which people still find difficult to even admit to. And that’s where our podcast I think differs from all the other mental health stuff that's out there. We're not feeding into that juggernaut in the industry that's saying ‘let's be a victim’. We are focusing on empowering people,” explains Richard.
“I remember, one of the first things I ever heard Richard talk about, and I loved it, was how there has been a long fight for people to accept that it's okay to not be okay. That's a really important fight, and it was hard won. But for our young people, we both think we need to also make sure they understand that it's okay to be okay. Because there can be this scenario, especially now, where people embrace victim roles or damaged roles, and that's not good therapy,” adds Ciara.
The duo are also banking on their natural chemistry and easy conversational style to attract listeners who aren’t looking for psychobabble. “With each episode, we know there's a few notes we want to hit, but the conversation can go anywhere. It’s an organic style. I find when I'm talking to Richard, he might say something that makes me think or gives me an idea. We're not scripted, it’s more like we're teasing out stuff between ourselves,” says Ciara.
“It's a bit like jazz. We have a structure, we know the parameters, there’s a background beat, but we could go anywhere with it,” adds Richard. “We’ve recorded five episodes so far and one of our producers says it’s like listening to two pals having a really good chat, and that’s exactly what we want to put out there. We want it to be accessible and relatable.”
Over time, Richard and Ciara also hope that their podcast becomes collaborative, featuring input on topics from listeners. “We know there are lots of problems with social media, but one of the good things is how interactive it is. If we see we’re getting comments or messages from people saying things like ‘I'm running myself raggedly going things I don't want to do but I don't know how to stop’, we will be able to see that this is something people want to talk about, and this can help us structure our episodes as we go,” says Ciara.
They are also inviting people to email them with issues or topics they’d like to see covered on the podcast. “We’re already hearing from people saying they’ve sent an email. People really do want to talk about lots of things, but they don't necessarily want to talk to their family or their friends, because it's more private than that.”
In covering a wide range of topics, the podcast doesn’t have any particular target audience in mind. “Our target audience is really anybody, or rather, everybody,” says Ciara. “Obviously some of the episodes will be more applicable to certain people, but we’re not focusing on parenting or relationships, it’s the general messiness of life for people. It’s right across the spectrum.
“At the end of the day we’re interested in what goes on in people’s heads and we want to explore that. I’ve said this a few times, but the contents of other people’s heads is one of the most interesting things. Even with all of our experience and practice, people still surprise us.”
- is available now wherever you get your podcasts. Listeners are invited to email info@theyfuckyouup.ie if they would like Richard and Ciara to talk about any particular issue.